The Net Worth Mindset: How to Build Wealth Beyond Your Income

If you’ve ever been told that all you need to do is “make more money” to build wealth, this episode is going to shift everything for you.

I had the absolute pleasure of sitting down with Tania Brielle Mabrey, a powerhouse financial coach, speaker, and the host of The Wealth Agenda. Her approach to money isn’t just refreshing — it’s real. We talked about why net worth, not income, is the true measure of wealth, how emotional and cultural beliefs shape our financial behavior, and what it actually looks like to build wealth from the inside out.

Here’s my personal breakdown of our conversation, why it meant so much, and how you can take the next step in your own financial journey.

We’ve Been Taught to Chase the Wrong Goal

Tania said something in this episode that hit me hard (and clearly hit a nerve with our audience, too):

“Income is not the goal. Net worth building is the goal.”

Let’s be honest — most of us were raised to believe that if we get a good job, bring in a solid paycheck, and keep climbing that ladder, we’re doing it right. But Tania breaks down why that mindset can be so misleading. It’s not what you earn — it’s what you keep, what you grow, and what you protect.

And as she shared, many people don’t even know their net worth, much less use it as a guiding metric. If that’s you? No shame — but let’s change that.

Money Is Emotional (And That’s Not a Bad Thing)

One of the reasons I loved this conversation so much is that Tania brings a holistic approach to money. She’s not here just to hand you a budget template and call it a day. She’s talking about your emotions, your background, your identity — the parts of your story that affect how you relate to money every single day.

We talked about how most financial advice misses this entirely. When Tania started reading money books, she noticed they focused on math — but skipped over culture, trauma, self-worth, and fear. And guess what? Those are the exact things that keep so many people stuck in patterns that no spreadsheet can fix.

From Poverty to Purpose

Tania’s personal story is inspiring — but even more than that, it’s relatable. She grew up in poverty in Mississippi, raised by a single mom. She never saw herself as someone who could become a financial coach, let alone host a show on Fox. But she followed the nudge to share her story, wrote her book during COVID, and soon found herself helping others one conversation at a time.

What I love most is that she didn’t wait until she “had it all together.” She showed up while she was still in the process — and that’s something I hope encourages every coach, creative, and entrepreneur reading this.

How She Coaches Clients Toward Wealth

If you’re wondering what it actually looks like to work with someone like Tania, she laid it all out.

Her approach starts with defining what financial success means to each client. For some, it’s peace of mind. For others, it’s becoming work-optional. Maybe it’s buying a home for a parent or funding early retirement. Whatever the vision is, Tania builds a strategy from there — and yes, that includes diving into real numbers like budgets, pay stubs, insurance, and net worth statements.

She also made it clear: this is a six-month journey, not a quick fix. But it’s worth it, because it’s how real, lasting wealth is built.

The Problem With Lifestyle Creep

We touched on a big topic that comes up for so many entrepreneurs and professionals: lifestyle creep. You start making more money… and you also start spending more money. Before you know it, you’re making six figures and still living paycheck to paycheck.

That’s not wealth. That’s stress disguised as success.

Tania had one of my favorite truth bombs in this part of the conversation:

“If you’re in debt, you’re broke.”

It might sound harsh — but sometimes we need a wake-up call. Debt might allow us to maintain appearances, but it’s not freedom. And it’s definitely not leverage. Real wealth comes from intentionality, not indulgence.

The “Trust Recession” and Why Integrity Matters

Something else that came up was this idea of a trust recession. People are more skeptical than ever — not just in the financial space, but everywhere. But what Tania and I both agreed on is that this might actually be an integrity recession.

People are tired of being sold to. They’re craving real, values-driven leadership. And when someone like Tania shows up with honesty, humility, and receipts to back up her process — that’s when trust is earned.

Want to Build Wealth? Start Here.

If you’ve been feeling overwhelmed about your financial future, or unsure what steps to take next — this episode is the perfect place to start. Here’s what I want you to walk away with:

• Net worth is what matters most. Start tracking it and making decisions based on growth, not just income.
  
  

• Get intimate with your numbers. You can’t change what you don’t understand.
  
  

• Your money mindset matters. The stories you’ve been told about wealth, worth, and success are shaping your results more than you realize.
  
  

• You don’t have to do it alone. Whether it’s a coach, community, or accountability partner — support can fast-track your progress.
  
  

Grab Tania’s Free Gift

Tania has a free financial starter kit available at briellemabrey.com, including a net worth calculator to help you start this process with clarity. It’s the exact tool she uses with her clients, and it’s yours for free.

Final Thoughts

This conversation with Tania was one of those episodes that I know I’ll come back to again and again. Whether you’re just starting your wealth journey or ready to level up, The Net Worth Mindset is the shift we all need to make.

🎧 Catch the full episode wherever you listen to podcasts or watch it on YouTube.
💬 And if it made you think differently — send this blog or episode to a friend. Let’s build wealth, with purpose, together.

Chapters List

00:00 Introduction to Wealth Building Mindset

03:07 The Importance of Net Worth Over Income

06:12 Understanding Financial Coaching Process

09:04 Challenges in Marketing Financial Services

12:07 Advice for Aspiring Entrepreneurs

14:37 The Trust and Integrity Recession in Finance

17:28 Building Trust with Financial Advisors

20:17 Conclusion and Resources

Full Transcript

Tania Brielle Mabrey (00:00)

It's understanding what you want to accomplish, right? Because when you have that goal in mind, it changes everything about the way that you go about life.

Amanda Kaufman (00:28)

Hey, hey, and welcome back to the Amanda Kaufman show. I'm joined today by my friend, Tania Brielle Mabry, and she is a expert in money and in wealth. And I'm so excited to have her on the show today. How you doing today, Tania?

Tania Brielle Mabrey (00:45)

I'm amazing, Amanda. Thank you so much for having me on the show. I'm excited to be here.

Amanda Kaufman (00:50)

I love it. I love it. So I understand you do coaching, you do speaking. Like how do you how do you help people with money specifically?

Tania Brielle Mabrey (00:58)

Yeah, so I feel like what holds people up a lot of times when it comes to finances isn't just the numbers, right? It's about the mindset, the experiences, the psychology and the emotion. And when I was on my own wealth building journey, I'm still on it. But when I was starting it, I found out that so many of the books that I was reading just kind of dealt with the technical application, but they didn't deal with the culture and so many other factors.

So for me, I like to take a more comprehensive approach to finance and to wealth building and look at the full picture of the things that impact our wealth and not just the numbers.

Amanda Kaufman (01:35)

my gosh, I love that. That's so super powerful. if this was a three minute podcast, what would be the number one thing you wish people knew about creating wealth and money?

Tania Brielle Mabrey (01:46)

Yeah, so the number one thing that I tell people all the time is that income is not the goal. So many times we are taught to go to school, get a good job, and then we think that that's going to be the path to wealth building and that income is gonna be the key, and it's not. It's really about net worth. Net worth building is the key. And so many times people don't use that as the measuring stick. Sometimes people have never even calculated their net worth. So I am a huge proponent of using that as the framework.

for your wealth building.

Amanda Kaufman (02:18)

You know, I love that. One of my favorite stories is about this janitor. And as we know, janitors don't get compensated very much for their time and their hard work. But this janitor passed away after working in a school for most of his life. And he left an endowment of over $8 million as a janitor.

Tania Brielle Mabrey (02:40)

Mm. Mm.

Amanda Kaufman (02:41)

And I think

it really speaks to what you're saying is that income is for sure required. Like we all got to earn money. However, he was simply smart with his time, his frugality and his intentionality that he had the net worth to be able to leave an endowment like that. Yeah, yeah, that's so good. So, okay, I'm just so curious. Like when you went on your wealth journey, you you're reading these books, you're learning the technicalities.

Tania Brielle Mabrey (02:56)

Yes, I love that story.

Amanda Kaufman (03:07)

But why, I guess like it's important to send the elevator down, but I love asking like entrepreneurs, know, but why this? Clearly very intelligent. You've obviously figured things out. You're on your own wealth journey, as you said, but just the way you answered that question, I was like, this guy could probably do almost anything. Like why this? Why focus on this community? Why do you feel this is such a problem in the world that really deserves to be solved?

Tania Brielle Mabrey (03:32)

Yeah, I feel like this line of work chose me. I didn't choose it. Like I spent 20 years in technology and tech sales and during COVID, it was a COVID project that God put on my heart to write a book about my own wealth building journey. And so I wrote the book and I was like, really? Like you want me to write this book? Cause I grew up in poverty in Mississippi, single mom. And I was like, who am I to tell anybody about?

money. And so I just wrote down all the things that I had learned. I wrote it from the perspective of culture. I wrote it from the perspective of emotion and history and what it means to grow up, what money messages you inherit. And it just really resonated with people. And so then people started asking me to financially coach them. And so I did that part time for four or five years. And when I got an opportunity through my

job, they laid off all the sellers of one of my technologies. And so I got a package and I was like, okay, this is perfect time. I've been doing this part time, let me go and do it full time. And then within the same week, like Fox reached out to me to do the Wealth Agenda Show. And so it just all like worked out. And so I really feel like this work just found me and so I did it authentically.

Amanda Kaufman (04:49)

That's so humble. She's

like, yeah, and then Fox reached out to me and then I'm doing this show. that's amazing, though. And I think it's really a strong testimony to...

You know, anybody who is coaching, so easy to discount ourselves somehow, you know? It's like, oh, well, I grew up in poverty. Who am I to talk about money? And it's like, actually, you grew up in poverty and you obviously figured some things out. Who are you not to talk about this? Right? Like, why would you keep it a secret? You know? But we do that. Yeah.

Tania Brielle Mabrey (05:23)

Yeah, we do.

Our self-talk gets us out of more things I'm sure that it gets us into.

Amanda Kaufman (05:31)

It's so true. It's so true. So like when you're working with people nowadays like can you like walk me through the the process just sort of high level when you're working with somebody and they've decided like I want to have financial mastery I want it. want to develop my my wealth building skills Walk me through like how do you do that? How do you accomplish that?

Tania Brielle Mabrey (05:52)

Yeah, so the first thing that I do when I'm working with, so it depends on how they come in, right? Because I feel like either sometimes people read the book and that's enough, or some people come through the group coaching program. But when I'm working with someone one-on-one, the first thing that we do is we understand what it is that they want. Because what financial freedom,

or even like financial accomplishment looks like is different. Some people just don't want anxiety, right? Some people have family members that are just always asking because they're the one that made it and they don't know how to manage that, right? So we talk about what are your key paying points? Like what is really bothering you right now? And then we take a comprehensive look. Like I tell people, look, one, I'm a getting your butt financial coach, so I'm gonna keep it real. And two, I'm gonna get all in your business. So we take a comprehensive look.

at their net worth, we look at their insurance, we look at their paycheck stubs, we look at their budget. And I tell people it's gonna take about six months, but I encourage people to get really intimate with their numbers. And so that's the process. We talk about their goals, we talk about where they are, we talk about where they wanna go, and then we're like, all right, are you on track to get there or not? What do you need to know? What do you need to understand? What issues do you need to face within yourself, right? Because the numbers are gonna tell the truth.

Like I always say, know budgets will tell you the truth and so we just do the hard work and you know Sometimes it's you know, hey, let's just make these tweaks Sometimes it's tears and it's mistakes and it's really like weighty things that you have to work through and so we just Start at the beginning and then we take a comprehensive approach we fine-tune along the way and then we say okay Where do we want to go from here? And so that's that's been the process

Amanda Kaufman (07:10)

That's it? Yeah, that's true.

it. So you're working with people personally on this generally, right?

Tania Brielle Mabrey (07:42)

Yes, yeah, I work with people across different platforms, right? So, but with the show, it's a larger educational platform. I take a limited number of one-on-one coaching clients, and then I do the group coaching program, which is a mix of like hot seats and education, right? So when people really wanna fill in those gaps, because I think that's really important too, the financial literacy, the financial competency, I want people to be both competent and confident in their finances.

Amanda Kaufman (08:08)

I love this. Now, like a lot of people that listen to our show, they're building a business or they have the ambition to do so. And it strikes me that, you know, there's quite a lot of statistics that support that you will never run out of a market. You will always have a lot of people who are, you know, wanting to improve their financial position. But I'm just so curious, just like from your own business perspective, what have you found to be the most challenging thing about marketing it, even knowing that it's a big problem?

Tania Brielle Mabrey (08:37)

Yeah, I think that the two things that I say is that people, I look to market for people who know they want to be better and are ready to do the work. And that second piece is so important. And sometimes people will even reach out not realizing that they're not ready, right? And you can tell by the way that they follow up or by the way that they, you know, interact or they say, yeah, I'm ready, I'm ready. And you send them the invoice and then they don't pay. You're like, you're not ready because.

you don't have the value and the mindset yet. And I think that even with entrepreneurship, so many people have business dreams and ideas and goals. And what keeps them from really even achieving that is their own personal finances. So I think both in the marketing, when it comes to my business and the relationship of entrepreneurs with their own money or soon to be or aspiring entrepreneurs, that can be the key that's really holding a lot of people back from doing what they want to do.

professionally as well.

Amanda Kaufman (09:35)

You know, I love that call out. hosted, I did about a bunch of live events several years ago and one of them, we have like 27 people in the room and every one, every two person, apart from me, had flown in, you know, paid for the hotel, come to the event. I didn't charge a lot for the event. I was really just excited about having people there. And I just stumbled on this question and...

I had told a personal story about how as an entrepreneur I'd maxed out my credit cards. And I kind of saw that twinkle in the eye of several people as I was speaking and I just asked this question and it just blew me away. And it was like, you ever maxed out a credit card and not told your partner? Because.

Tania Brielle Mabrey (10:14)

Thank you.

Mmm.

Amanda Kaufman (10:18)

big investment in this business and then how many of you are still frustrated that you are where you are with your business? And it was like literally to a man, a woman, everybody in that room, they were like, I've been there and I've done that. So that was so illuminating for me because you're right. Like so many people would have more capacity to grow the business or do the thing if they weren't already incredibly overextended. Yeah.

Tania Brielle Mabrey (10:44)

Yes, yep.

Amanda Kaufman (10:45)

So

what would be your top piece of advice to somebody who maybe finds themselves in that position? Maybe they hate their job, but they're kind of hanging on to it because they like the paycheck, but maybe they're like nervous because we've got a lot of disruption that's happening right now. Companies are changing, they're offering packages and things like that. And like this person's thinking, well, I want to be an expert. I want to get paid for what I know. What would be your top piece of advice to that person who's in that situation?

Tania Brielle Mabrey (11:12)

Yeah, I think I would provide a two-step process. And one, I would say you want to minimize your spending as much as possible so that you can create that nest egg. And sometimes you have to make those cuts that are painful, right? So when we were in our process of becoming debt-free, we couponed, we went to the family nights, eat free, you know.

We had a living situation that was far below our means. Like we made some really tough decisions in terms of our lifestyle in order to save and pay off debt. And I think you have to prioritize it. I think that one of the biggest misconceptions people make is that they feel like because they have the income to support their lifestyle on a month to month basis, that that's okay. But I always tell people, if you're in debt, you're broke.

And so you have to have that mindset about what you're doing because like how you're spending, know, the decisions that you're making each and every month, you have to have that mindset so that you can have that savings cushion. I think some people, you know, they may be making six figures, but there was a recent Yahoo survey, Yahoo Finance article that said 47 % of people who make over six figures are still living paycheck to paycheck, which means they don't have a savings.

Amanda Kaufman (12:34)

I know that's

Tania Brielle Mabrey (12:36)

Right?

Amanda Kaufman (12:37)

I know that's true. I know that's true. I have too many friends that I know that that is like absolutely their reality. And I agree with you. think like lifestyle creep is one of the biggest saboteurs of being able to make new investments. You said something so interesting. You said if you're in debt, you're broke. What do you really mean by that?

Tania Brielle Mabrey (12:59)

I mean that sometimes people, because that's the net worth mindset, right? So let's say you have $5,000 in income per month. So you're spending, you know, $5,000 net, right? You feel like you can, but you have $10,000 in credit card debt. Well, if you don't, you know, have any other assets or anything like that.

then that $10,000 means you don't have $2,000 of disposable income, regardless of what your monthly income minus expenses says. You're broke. You need to go pay that off. And so until you pay off your debt, especially your consumer debt, debt that's not producing value, then you're broke. And I think people don't think about it that way. And so I think that lifestyle creep is the number one advice that you see.

Amanda Kaufman (13:18)

That's it.

you

I think

you're right. think there's a lot of like kicking the can down the road, you know, using debt to just like avoid a pain in the moment and having kind of that mistaken thinking that you're, you know, making a cut back on your lifestyle is like all that painful. And I'm like, well,

For me anyway, I found that I need to have a lot more clarity about what would I do if I wasn't in debt or what would I do if I had more leverage here.

and find it painful that you're not doing that, you know what I mean? Instead of the pain of the convenience of all of it. So yeah, okay, cool. This is amazing. So if you could wave a magic wand and you could get people to just like change one thing right away, what would that one, what would you want them to change about maybe their habits or their beliefs around their ability to change their financial situation?

Tania Brielle Mabrey (14:28)

.

I think it's what you just said. It's understanding what you want to accomplish, right? Because when you have that goal in mind, it changes everything about the way that you go about life.

Is it that you want to have a sense of peace, that you don't want to have anxiety? Is it that you want to become work optional? Is it that...

you want to retire at 40 or at 50, or you want to buy a property for your parent, what is it that's driving you? The whole Simon Sinek, start with why. And I think that's why the financial goals are so important, because when you have that goal in mind, it informs your behaviors.

And to your point, when you have to say, well, we're not gonna go to this concert, or we're not going to...

You're not saying no to these things. You realize that you're saying yes to your bigger goal. And so I think that for me, that's why it's so important to start with financial goal setting because it's like, okay, well, what's driving you?

Amanda Kaufman (15:36)

I love.

What's driving you and like this is fundamental to coaching like you cannot achieve a goal that you don't understand in the first place, right? And what a lot of people do is is they sit in their anxiety their misery their depression their rumination Because they're complaining that their life isn't isn't what they had in mind and it's like well What do you have in mind and it's so interesting because a lot of people actually really do have a hard time articulating that and that's one of the great values of coaching is to be able to You know kind of slow the conversation

down a hot minute and especially working with a trusted advisor and that actually brings me up to another kind of a question for you.

Lately, I've been hearing a lot more about this trust recession. And I've got a little bit of a hot have you heard of this the trust recession like that? Okay, it's basically this idea that it's harder to make sales and it's harder to market because consumers are in a lower state of trust right now due to due to technology changes due to socioeconomic reasons, like there's all these reasons why people are less trusting is what they've called it. And so

Tania Brielle Mabrey (16:40)

Mm-hmm.

Amanda Kaufman (16:42)

I'm hearing that and I'm thinking, I feel like it's actually an integrity recession. And what I mean by that is like, people would trust you if they like, I feel like people trust by default. And so if there's a reduction in trust, the next natural question is like, why? And I think about your space, I think about, you know, the financial industry. And a lot of people I think feel maybe

Tania Brielle Mabrey (16:47)

Mmm.

Amanda Kaufman (17:08)

like tricked or bamboozled or like they can't trust because I mean you can't go to a friggin underwear store without being offered a new credit card. You know what I'm talking about right? Like credit cards and everything.

Tania Brielle Mabrey (17:19)

Yeah, yeah. you like

this line of credit with that bra?

Amanda Kaufman (17:28)

Exactly, you you get 20 % off if you buy your bra and panties and you put it on like this, this kind of card. I'm like, this is so beyond like ridiculous, but I think it is our society is so like capitalistic. It's so like, what's the opportunity? And it really preys on our standard of education around finances as well.

And so to me, I'm like, I think there's an integrity recession. Like, I think that there's a lot of people that are like creating these ridiculous scenarios where it's like, why are you going to debt over broad pennies? Like, why are you doing that? But people do, right? And so I'm just so curious, like,

Tania Brielle Mabrey (17:51)

Yes.

Amanda Kaufman (18:07)

What's your take on that and the distrust that people have in being able to talk to someone like yourself and tell the truth and be real and be raw with like where they are to begin to get the support that they need because you know the support can speed you up considerably against your goals but like the longer you leave it and the longer you ignore it and the longer you cast it aside and by the way if you happen to have that that credit card like no worries i'm bringing it up because my husband can't

home with it one day and I was just like, what the heck are you doing? Right. don't worry, we made it off. But the point is, it's just like, there's

Tania Brielle Mabrey (18:43)

No, that's right.

Amanda Kaufman (18:46)

such this entanglement, I think of like people paying so much to like even have access to money and it's so normalized to, to take on debt for frankly, very silly reasons. So like, what's your take on that? Where do think we are as a society on that?

Tania Brielle Mabrey (19:03)

Yeah, I think it's both things, right? I think of both as a trust recession. And I think especially with everything that you said going on in our social, economic, and macro political landscape and macro economic, that people

making choices have a higher risk when you have less resources or you have less resources to replenish if you make a wrong decision. And so I think that that sense, and in some ways it's a scarcity mindset and in some ways it's a reality, right? And so when you have that as your backdrop, it makes you more cautious. So I think there is that sense of a lack of trust just going on or erosion of trust because if you make the wrong decision, there's

a bigger consequence, right? And I think that people have been scammed and scammed and not just in finance, in every industry, right? The amount of people that are scamming seniors just in everyday ways, like you won this contest, there's just a lack of an erosion of integrity period. And so what I tell people is, but don't throw the baby out with the bathwater, right? You still have...

to your point about working with advisors, working with professionals still has tremendous value. And so what I tell people like my clients, because I'm a financial coach, I'm not a financial advisor, and so I help people to build their teams. And so I say, listen, what you wanna do is ask for referrals. What you wanna do is follow those people for a while, get a sense of what they're doing and what they're about, watch podcasts, get a sense of who they are. They have a book, read it, right?

Do multiple interviews, have your questions set up, and then see what the contractual language is, right? So I have a minimum amount of time that I wanna work with, that I work with people one-on-one, and then after that, you're free to go, right? So it's not a forever commitment, and then find out what structure works for you. For people in this industry, some people are hourly, some people are fee-based, right? And so sometimes there's more, I mean, some people are hourly, some people are percentage-based.

And so there's the flat fee, there's the hourly, and then there's a percentage of assets under management. And so you have to make a determination of what model works best for you. And then trust your gut, but it may be some trial and error, but don't put everything on the line. So if you want to work with a financial coach, then that person's not going to have access to your investment portfolio and is managing your money today. Or if you want to work.

with a financial advisor that may manage your portfolio, then maybe you feel better with just a flat fee arrangement versus a percentage because you don't know what they're putting you in or what their motivations are. So I would just say, do your research. It's not forever. Figure out the minimal level of exposure that you're comfortable with, but still make those decisions because over time, it's going to...

pay off or if you just can't do it, then do the research, do the education. I mean, the information is out there. You just have to go out and get it.

Amanda Kaufman (22:09)

That's it.

Yeah, yeah, that's so true. That's so true. I feel like we could talk for like several hours here. However, I didn't book you that long. So what is the best way for people to follow you?

Tania Brielle Mabrey (22:16)

you

Yeah, so I love LinkedIn. I was like, are you Toki? God bless you.

Amanda Kaufman (22:29)

I'm so sad that our conversation is concluding that I am choked up.

Tania Brielle Mabrey (22:33)

Yes, but LinkedIn, Tania Brio, Maybree, people can reach out there.

Amanda Kaufman (22:38)

Yeah, great, awesome. And we were talking about a really amazing gift that you may have for our guests. So what is that?

Tania Brielle Mabrey (22:44)

Yes,

yes, so on my website brielmaybree.com is a free financial starter kit where you can grab a calculator that's going to help you to calculate your net worth, which is such an important starting point. yeah, grab it there.

Amanda Kaufman (23:00)

I this. love this. One of my favorite

like t-shirts and mugs of all time is, ooh, this calls for a spreadsheet. So I'm definitely going to be checking out your spreadsheet. I love it. So good. Hey, dear listener, don't forget to subscribe because you just never know. You might run into another Tania that you absolutely need to hear from here on the show.

Below the in the show notes in the description You're gonna see all her links that you can follow up with her check out her website You know send her a connect on LinkedIn all the good things and don't forget to Rate the show that helps people to find it to make the choice to listen to us and hey if you've got a friend that you know that they have been talking about making their money right, but they haven't quite done so Grab the link to this episode and send it over to them so they can think about it while they're out for a walk or washing the dishes

All right, y'all, make sure that you do what matters and I'll see you in another episode.

Tania Brielle Mabrey (23:53)

Thanks, Amanda.