Why More Clients ≠ More Money (And What Actually Works!)

In a world that often glorifies numbers—bigger audiences, more followers, and massive email lists—it’s easy to assume that success is directly tied to quantity. But what if the real secret to thriving in business isn’t about having more people in the room, but about building deeper relationships with the right ones? That’s exactly what Patty Farmer, a marketing and media strategist, shared in my recent conversation with her on The Amanda Kaufman Show.

The Biggest Myth in Business Growth

Patty made a powerful statement that challenged a common misconception: More people does not necessarily mean more money. This flies in the face of what many entrepreneurs believe—that larger audiences equal bigger paychecks. But in reality, the quality of your relationships and how well you command attention matter far more than sheer numbers.

As Patty explained, too many business owners focus on trying to appeal to everyone instead of honing in on the right people. “It’s about making meaningful connections and ensuring that you stand out in a crowded marketplace,” she said. Attention is a currency—without it, even the best products and services can go unnoticed.

Relationships Over Transactions

The heart of any successful business is built on relationships. Think about it—how many times have you made a purchase because you trusted someone’s recommendation or connected with a brand’s message? Relationships foster trust, and trust leads to long-term clients, referrals, and sustainable growth.

Patty emphasized the importance of strategic partnerships, or what she calls power partners—people who already serve your target audience and can introduce you to them in a meaningful way. “Find the people who are already catering to the market you want to be in and build relationships with them,” she advised. This strategy is far more effective than cold marketing tactics that feel transactional rather than relational.

The Power of Small Rooms

One of my favorite takeaways from our conversation was Patty’s insight about the power of small, intimate settings. She shared that some of her most successful events had fewer attendees, which allowed for deeper conversations and stronger connections.

“If you treat every person in the room like they’re the one person who needed to be there, you create an unforgettable experience,” she said. This is a game-changing mindset shift, especially for coaches and service providers who worry about audience size. Smaller audiences can actually create bigger impact.

Standing Out in a Crowded Market

With so much noise online, it can feel overwhelming to get noticed. But according to Patty, the key to standing out is clarity—knowing exactly what value you bring and communicating it effectively. “The best way to command attention is to be crystal clear on your message and to consistently show up as yourself,” she said.

A big part of this is authentic confidence—embracing who you are and how you naturally communicate. People are drawn to authenticity, and the more you lean into your unique voice, the more you’ll attract the right clients.

The Confidence to Be Yourself

One of the most powerful moments in our conversation was when Patty shared her own journey of stepping into public speaking. She admitted that for 18 months, she would get physically sick before stepping on stage. It wasn’t until a coach told her something life-changing that everything shifted: “You don’t need to change who you are to fit an audience—you need to find the audience that wants to hear it the way you say it.”

That’s a lesson so many entrepreneurs need to hear. Instead of trying to fit into someone else’s mold, embrace what makes you different. Your uniqueness is your greatest selling point.

Are You Ready to Shift Your Focus?

If you’ve been focusing on numbers instead of relationships, or if you’ve been struggling to get noticed, consider this your wake-up call. Success isn’t about reaching the most people—it’s about reaching the right people.

Start building relationships, find your power partners, and step into your unique voice with confidence. The people who truly need you will find you—if you show up authentically and consistently.

What’s one shift you can make today to focus more on relationships and attention in your business? Drop a comment and let’s start the conversation!

Chapter List:

00:00 Introduction to Joy in Business

02:28 The Importance of Delegation

05:05 Building Relationships as Currency

08:01 Embracing Authenticity in Coaching

11:57 Navigating the Coaching Landscape

14:32 The Value of Small Audiences
17:30 Final Thoughts and Resources

Full Transcript

Patty Farmer (00:00)

The fact of the matter is a lot of times people like to think that the more people that are in the room the more money you're gonna make and that is false.

Amanda Kaufman (00:25)

Well, hello and welcome back to the Amanda Kaufman show. I am so excited to have you here today, Patty. Welcome.

Patty Farmer (00:34)

Thanks so much for having me. I'm so excited. Every conversation I have with you is a great one. This is one of my favorite topics talking about how we can help coaches. So I'm excited for the conversation.

Amanda Kaufman (00:45)

Yes, me too. love it. So dear listener, Patty Farmer is an award winning marketing and media strategist. She's a dynamic international speaker, podcast host, magazine publisher, and seven figure event producer based right here in Dallas, Texas. With her proven strategies, she helps entrepreneurs attract, engage, and convert their ideal clients with confidence and clarity. And whether she is on the stage behind the mic or coaching one-on-one,

Patty's energy, and I'm going to definitely punctuate that her energy and her insights inspire action and drive success. She loves working with service-based women entrepreneurs, small business owners, coaches, content creators to help them to identify their target audience, communicate their value, package their expertise into profitable, I love that word, products and services. And Patty's mission is to help her clients design the lifestyle that they desire and build a business that supports it.

not the other way around, ensuring that everything they do brings them joy and feeds their soul while maximizing results, relationships and revenue. Boy, boy, I feel so lucky to have you here, Patty. So I'm just so curious what motivates you to focus so much on the joy of building a business as opposed to simply the task list and the profits and all that kind of thing. Why joy?

Patty Farmer (02:07)

think for me the reason why is because we didn't become a CEO, right? You we became a CEO because...

We want money freedom, time freedom, all the things of why we want to do it. And I think a lot of times what happens with coaches and entrepreneurs is they become firefighters, right? You know, they become firefighters instead of being the CEOs that they wanted to be in the beginning. So it has really become my mission for them to be able to say, let's stop having to be a firefighter, go back to being a CEO so that you can just have this whole joy of why you did it in the first place, whatever your reasons are, because everybody's reasons are different.

Amanda Kaufman (02:28)

Mm.

Patty Farmer (02:42)

Right? You know, and so whatever they are, let's design that and let's have you have lots and lots of joy.

Amanda Kaufman (02:49)

love that and you know when you see people running around like a firefighter you know without necessarily having the support what are some of the things you you notice that they spend too much time on or they're maybe too worried about

Patty Farmer (03:02)

think the most important one is they think they have to have their finger on everything. Right? You know, like it's kind of, they're the bottleneck. They become the bottleneck because they feel like it's their business and they want everything to go and they don't really delegate. Or even if they do delegate as it goes up the top, they still want to have their finger in there. Right? You know, and when they do that, it's like, takes so much time. It's kind of like,

Find good talent and then trust them, do what you do best, and then let them do what you hire them for that they do best as well. And it is something that I have to tell you people struggle with a lot. And sometimes they don't even realize that they do.

Amanda Kaufman (03:40)

It's so interesting and I vibe with that. I resonate with that. I know like the delegation piece is very challenging because, I think another reason why we become entrepreneurs and CEOs is because, and founders, is we want to create something that's never been created before, but I think that that can almost create like an anxiety about like, ooh, well, what if it doesn't work? What if it's not good enough? Or what if this thing that I've built falls apart, you know?

Those thoughts are super common. I'm curious, like, what are you seeing work the best for people that you work with in terms of marketing and attracting clients? Like, what's working really well right now?

Patty Farmer (04:23)

think the biggest thing is that I truly believe with all my heart that relationships are the currency in today's business environment, right?

backed up with that. The second thing is attention. Attention is the currency. So really you need to be able to be building relationships and making sure that we're in a crowded marketplace right now and there's a lot of noise. How are you standing out and really commanding that attention? So that's getting really, really clear on your messaging and what the value is that you bring to the marketplace and then surrounding yourself with the right power partner, so to speak, that can help you get out in front of

markets all the time, right? And the best way to do that obviously is to build relationships with people who are already catering to that market.

Amanda Kaufman (05:05)

That's so good. I love that. And that's part of why we're supporting each other as well, is we have complementary and sometimes overlapping skills. your person that you love to work with, you do things in a particular way, and I do things in a particular way. And that collaboration, think, is super important. Something I hear a lot of people in our community talk about is just concerns about, like you just said, it's so busy. It's a saturated marketplace.

is something that I hear all the time. I take a bit of exception to that because I have done the research to understand that actually, you know, coaching is a growing market as in there's more demand than there ever was before. What would you say to somebody who is actually concerned about, you know, maybe not being able to stand apart or maybe there's somebody who's like really introverted and they don't see themselves as being somebody that's gonna jump up and, you know, say, hey, pay attention to me. Like, what would you tell them?

Patty Farmer (06:01)

Well, the first thing I tell them is that if they did their research right now, 1.6 million searches are done on Google every single month for people looking for a coach. 1.6 million searches. I mean, that's amazing. So people are looking. So I think all you really need to do is to ask yourself, what is it that you do a little bit differently? What differentiates you? And a lot of times people don't think about it and...

You know, like for me, what I feel like differentiates me is because I always start with lifestyle, right? Everything for me goes back to let's design the lifestyle first, right? You know, I mean, look at the things that you're teaching about your first five clients, right? You know, so what is the thing that makes you different? And it is usually the thing that brings you joy. If you really think about it, it's like, you know, there was a question that people used to ask a long time ago. I always thought it was a silly question, but I think it's really not so silly as we think. What would you do if somebody wasn't paying you

It that you love it so much that you would do it even if you weren't getting paid for it now first of all don't do it if you're not getting paid for it however But in your heart what what brings you that joy though right that you just love it and for me I could always tell and I don't know if this happens to you or to anybody who's listening but for me when I'm talking to somebody and like the hair on my arms kind of gets I kind of get this little tingle and it's like my gosh I want to roll up my sleeves. I want to get in their business. I know that I can help them right and I

Amanda Kaufman (07:01)

There's that.

Patty Farmer (07:22)

know what my expertise is and what I can really do. You know my superpower so to speak is really monetizing because if you monetize the things that you do that gives you more time to be able to do the things that bring you joy right. So just to kind of ask yourself what are those things and it may seem like a teeny little thing but then you can expand on that and start saying well how could I develop that? What could I do or who do I know right that's in the marketplace that maybe we could do that together and we could just plant this seed and it could

Lawsome, but you want to make sure that you're doing the thing you want to do and not just trying to be like Some other coach that you're like, yeah, I like what they say So I'm gonna try to be them because no matter what you do You can't be them because they're them and you're you and people want to be able to work with you For the unique person that you are. So I always want to say just be unapologetically you and there will be people who want to work with you

Amanda Kaufman (08:01)

It's so true.

See,

this is actually one of the reasons why I love working with coaches that are earlier in their client acquisition journey and they're like learning how to sell and they're learning how to market and they're learning how to step into it is selfishly as a coach, I love seeing that power. Like seeing people activate into trusting themselves and developing that confidence that only comes from daring yourself to actually step into.

those things and I call it the decision, right? It's this decision that you're gonna do the thing. And I still remember my own decision when I was starting my business, all I saw online were the Barbies and the bros, like just people, and this is not knock, if you're listening and you're like, hey, I'm blonde and tall and beautiful, amazing, good for you. That's not me though, right? Like use it, totally use it. But I didn't have that to work with. So I allowed,

my deficiencies to define what I was not allowed to have for a really long time. And I love what you just said about being unapologetically you. I was like, you know what? I'm a mom in suburbia with four kids who wanted to leave corporate America and to do coaching more. Like, that's it. That's who I am. You know, you can take it, you can leave it, but it's not actually up to me to make that decision for you.

And it's amazing what happened after that, like just how receptive people were. And also my business became a lot more fun.

Patty Farmer (09:40)

No, you know, I had this client once who did look like Barbie. She was like, you know, she really looked like she could be a Barbie doll. And she's like, well, who's going to take me seriously? And we built this whole campaign for her around Be Your Own Barbie. Like we just, was the elephant in the room. And we just built this whole marketing thing about, know, I can help you be your own Barbie. And it was very, very successful for her. But when I'm thinking about what you said, I remember my journey.

Amanda Kaufman (09:53)

So good.

Patty Farmer (10:05)

And one of the things for me was when I decided to step into speaking, like I didn't really want to be a speaker. I was a trainer and they're not the same thing, right? You know, I'm an educator at heart and I really didn't want to be a public speaker. And when I decided to be a speaker by accident, which is a whole nother story, but when I decided to do it, I literally got sick, like violently ill for like 18 months every time before I would get on the stage, like every single time. And I couldn't figure it out.

And

I hired a coach, why it took me that long, I don't know. But I hired a specific speaking coach. And she said to me, says, well, Patty, you're successful as far as the money, right? You know, like you're making money, whatever. Why are you still sick? And I said, I don't know. So she asked me a couple of questions. And here is what I found out. That for me, I felt like I wasn't, you know, Patricia Tripp. Like I didn't want to wear a soap opera dress and like it wasn't who I was. And she said one thing that set me free and changed

the trajectory of my business. And what she said was, Patty, it isn't you changing you to get in front of people that you think want to hear what you want to hear. It's that you getting in front of stages and getting in front of people who want to hear it the way you say it. And that set me free and changed everything in my business. Once I actually accepted that I don't want to be somebody who gets on the stage and, you know, makes a point and takes a pregnant pause and wears a soap opera dress. That wasn't me, right? You know, and nobody's going to get that.

went

from me like I am who I am. This is me. But I will tell you Amanda, the greatest compliment I've ever received and I hear it over and over and over again is when people say, you know what, Patty, you're exactly the same. If I meet you in person on the stage on a call, whatever you are you and you're exactly that because haven't we all met somebody where like, you know, you followed them and then you meet them and you're like, Whoa, they're not anything like what they perceive to be. Who wants to have to try to do that? I am me unapologetically either I fit for you and you love it. Great.

If I don't let me know and I'll find somebody else for you because I'm sure I know that person, tell me what you're looking for and I'll connect you to them.

Amanda Kaufman (12:04)

I love that. Like I have a dear friend and he calls that authentic confidence. know, just this, cause there's the confidence that's projected, like you said, you know, that it's like, well, I think I'm supposed to show up like this. So I'm gonna sort of show up like that, but it doesn't feel congruent and true for me. So, you know, you end up with that duality, that kind of masking effect. And, you know, I'll just vouch right here. And now one of the reasons why I...

Connected with you so so quickly I got back into in-person networking which I had not done for years Was because I saw so much consistency and and I'll tell you a little secret It wasn't just consistency of when I saw you it's because I had a friend who told me a little bit about you before I met you so I had like this consistency consistency consistency that it's like okay, like I can trust this person and I want to spend more time with them because

Frankly, I think a lot of people are really struggling with showing up as their full selves. How important do you think that really is for a coach?

Patty Farmer (13:03)

I think it's really important because first of all, you're not being who you are, you're not going to be able to keep it up. You know what I mean? It's going to shine through somewhere. Like, you know what I mean? I mean, it's kind of like...

back when you were a little kid, right? You told the little fib and you were like, gosh, now I got to try to remember the lie I told so I don't get in trouble. I mean, it always comes out, right? So the fact of the matter is if you just make the decision to say, I'm going to be unapologetically me, right? I mean, you don't have to try to remember who that is because it is just you and people will either like that will literally attract them or it'll repel them. But I have to tell you as a coach, I love that because I don't want people to be like in the, I don't know. Kind of like I want them to either be able to say, yes, you are my

Amanda Kaufman (13:20)

Right?

Patty Farmer (13:42)

person or no you're not. I mean now sometimes there's no not now and there's reasons for that but really honestly I just want them to make a decision am I the person for you? Am I not the person for you? Because I can help you either way like I said you know I can introduce you to somebody else but there's nothing worse than being in that whole space in the middle where they him and hog because they just don't want to tell you that you're not the person. I'm like you know what I would rather somebody say no just no is great because right after no guess what's after that next.

Amanda Kaufman (14:09)

Full sentence. Yeah,

Patty Farmer (14:10)

No is next.

Amanda Kaufman (14:11)

yeah, it's absolutely a full sentence. I recently launched the first five club and at first I was like really nervous because it was quite different than anything I had ever offered my community and my list. And I gotta tell you something, like as soon as I started sending the emails, I saw a spike in the unsubscribes and I was like, see, they don't like it.

But you know what I did is I immediately looked at the clicks. I'm like, but I'm getting clicks too. And the people that are clicking are clicking email after email. They're really thinking about this. Like this seems to be, so I decided, I was like, you know what? I have conviction that this is the right thing that I'm gonna do right now. And it's okay if people wanna get off the bus, right? And I got really excited for the people who were intentional about staying. And I think,

You know, one thing I thought maybe you might have a really good perspective on, Patty, is what do say to somebody who is a beginner coach and they're worried that their lack of experience is going to prevent them from ever getting a client? What would you say to them?

Patty Farmer (15:12)

say that as long as you've done your work and you're you and you're not just regurgitating somebody else

you're going to be okay. I think the only problem there is when somebody's new and they're regurgitating somebody else's information because then they're going to run out of information because they're only going to have whatever it is that they have from that person. And then they're going be like, what do I do now? Right. So I would say, make sure that you really stay who you are and then do your work, hire a mentor and or coach yourself. Cause coaches have coaches, right? I don't know about you, but I have like two or three of them usually at a time, depending upon what it is that I am doing. And I think,

Amanda Kaufman (15:32)

Mm-hmm.

Patty Farmer (15:48)

that is really important. So that would be my answer. But I want to say something about what you just said too, is when you were saying about the unsubscribes, I have to tell you, we've probably all heard that expression, I'm sure a lot of times, is where people will say, you know, if it gives you a stomach ache or makes you sick to your stomach, that's when you know you're supposed to do it. Like when you're so uncomfortable, when you have that discomfort. That is true. But I'm going to tell you, when you see unsubscribes and things like that happen, that is valid.

Amanda Kaufman (16:09)

Mmm.

Patty Farmer (16:16)

As well and here's why monetization is my specialty and here's why people pay to be on your email list Whether you realize or not, they don't pay but you do right because most CRMs are on tiered depending upon how many people you have on there So if somebody is on your email list to get some freebie or something they just wanted or they wanted to watch your funnel or whatever The reason is and they're actually not interested and stuff. It's it's it's costing money for them to be there I would rather them unsubscribe. So I find when I get that

little spike of unsubscribes like that and stuff. good. They're opting out because this isn't for them. Great. Because you know that it's a percentage game. That's just like the algorithm, right? So in actuality, that should tell you, my gosh, I am onto something. Because when you want people to either love what you're doing or go, you know what? That's not for me. I'm out. That's the things that you actually want. Either I'm in or I'm out.

Amanda Kaufman (17:05)

Mm-hmm.

Exactly. Exactly. I know when I started as a coach, I was so people-pleasy. I was so worried about offending everybody. And, and part of it was, I'm Canadian. I can't help it. You know, we're very polite, but I think the other piece of it was that I had been up to that point in my career, a very strong introvert introvert, you know, I got all my recharge time by being in isolation and alone. And you know, so

Patty Farmer (17:30)

So hard to picture that.

Amanda Kaufman (17:37)

When I started, my list was so small. I had like eight people on it. It was like so small. And you know, I think a lot of people are really afraid of that small, small space being seen to start small. And you know, I think that's probably one of the best advice I got from one of my coaches is like never be afraid to be seen to start small because most people won't even start.

Patty Farmer (17:56)

What I would say there,

here would be my thing I would say there. It doesn't matter how many people are in the room. Doesn't matter how many people come to your podcast. Doesn't matter how many people on your email list. If you treat every single one of them like they are the one person that needed to be there, that needed to hear what you said, that's all that matters. When I first started doing my seven figure events that I do in New York, the very first time I had 14 people. That's it. That's all that showed up was 14 people and I remember thinking.

Amanda Kaufman (18:20)

I had eight at mine, my very first one. And

you know what's crazy? I couldn't get people locally to come to the event at all. was like networking like crazy. Everybody was busy that weekend. No one could make it. But I still had eight people come and those eight people got on planes to be in the room with me, which that was like, blew my mind.

Patty Farmer (18:24)

Okay, I like that one. my gosh, only four.

that but I

say this all time and it happens in in-person networking too. In-person, virtual, on your email list, everywhere. The fact of the matter is the people that are there are the most important people that are there and for some reason a lot of times people like to think that the more people that are in the room the more money you're gonna make and that is false.

Absolutely false. Sometimes having less people in the room so now you actually get to really hone in on them. Like I know one of the things that I love is when

Amanda Kaufman (19:00)

Not true.

Patty Farmer (19:10)

This is one of my favorite things is when a coach will offer like office hours or Q &A or whatever where everybody can come in and then you show up and there's only two people and first you're like and then you're like, my gosh It's like I just get one-on-one coaching right now. You know what I'm saying I mean, I love it when we go to those things and everybody else just puts their questions in there and I go there and I show up I mean that is such an opportunity to be there because you don't know how many other people so I'm gonna tell you it isn't about the big

I have closed rooms where I've had, you know, very small amounts of people where there were 25 people in the room, you know, and made multiple six figures. And then I've been in rooms where I've had hundreds of people. I made the same multi-six figure and it was a lot more work. Right? So the number doesn't matter. People need to just get past that.

Amanda Kaufman (19:52)

amazing.

I really love that. And that's been my shared experience as well. It's more about the quality of the relationship that you have than anything else. This is so good. Well, Patty, like if people wanted to follow you, like what's the best way to do that?

Patty Farmer (20:11)

Well, you can go to my website, which is pattyfarmer.com, Patty with a Y, pattyfarmer.com, everything's there. Magazine, podcasts, all the ways that you can get a hold of me are all there in one place to make it nice and easy on my social, et cetera.

Amanda Kaufman (20:23)

I love that. I love that. And I understand you have a little gift for people that want to check out your business assessment. Is that right?

Patty Farmer (20:31)

Absolutely. So one of the things I feel like kind of goes with what we're talking about. I mean as it should, right? You know, but I have this business assessment that's three minutes or less and it will literally tell you here's where you're doing great. Here's where you might want to make a few changes and here's a few things you could do for massive growth. Like I said, it takes less than three minutes, but it will help you to know that and it also will help you to know to look at those things and see, here's where I might want to bring in a partner. Here's where I might want to collaborate with somebody else.

So

does a lot of things in there, so it will give you lot of information. And to get that, it's super easy. They can just go to m3bizquiz.com. So m3bizquiz.com. M3 stands for marketing media money, which is my brand. But m3bizquiz.com gets them there, and they'd be amazed at how much they'll find out about them and their business in three minutes.

Amanda Kaufman (21:20)

love that. I love that. If you've ever experienced any level of overwhelm with your business or you're kind of feeling like, am I working on the right thing? You know, what should I be focused on next? That's such a valuable tool. I love it. Well, Patty, thank you so much for joining us today.

Patty Farmer (21:35)

Thank you so much for having me. I love every conversation that you and I have. I love that we overlap. think that makes that conversations and so much more enriching and deep. So thank you so much for having me. I appreciate it.

Amanda Kaufman (21:46)

I

absolutely agree, I love it as well. And hey, listener, if you're not subscribed to the show, make sure you smash that subscribe button before you go. And hey, I'll bet you've got two or three friends that would really benefit from this conversation. Go ahead and forward the link to them. Send them a text, send them a DM, share this episode with them. And don't forget to leave a five star review so that if people are choosing what to listen to, they're more likely to choose this show. I think Patty really brought it.

And we will also make sure that we include all of Patty's links in the show notes as well. And thank you so much for making this show a part of your day. We'll see you next time.